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The Origins of APL - 1974

Catherine Lathwell

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  • Recommended by 3 people: 2 on Hacker News and 1 on Lobsters.
  • A classic. People kept recommending it from 2012 to 2019.

Intermediate. Assumes working knowledge.

17K views14 years ago3 recommendations

Programming languagesHistory and cultureLanguage design and type systemsHistory of computingPeople who shaped computing

The original developers of APL, including Kenneth Iverson and Adin Falkoff, discuss the history, design, and notation of the array programming language.

I posted this video on Myspace on July 20, 2009 where it has received 4604 views as of today. Talk show style in­ter­view with the orig­i­nal de­vel­op­ers of APL. Eric Iverson says my dad was off in Denmark at the time. I post­ed this video to pro­mote my doc­u­men­tary film about APL and its family of ar­ray pro­gram­ming lan­guages A/J/K/Q. A brief his­to­ry of this show, "The Ori­gins of APL" -​ from John R. Clarke At the 5th APL conference held in Toron­to Cana­da in 1973 it was agreed that the 6th conference would be held in Ana­heim Cal­i­for­nia with the Coast Com­mu­ni­ty Col­lege Dis­trict (CC­CD) as the host in­sti­tu­tion. The CC­CD, at the time, con­sist­ed of two col­leges Or­ange Coast Col­lege (OCC) and the Gold­en West Col­lege (GWC) and a Pub­lic Broad­cast Tele­vi­sion sta­tion KOCE. Rough­ly 45,000 stu­dents were en­rolled in the two schools. OCC was the first two year col­lege to teach com­put­ers start­ing in 1959. Dr. Iver­son had in­formed us at Toron­to that he would not serve as the ban­quet speak­er. This pre­sent­ed the or­ga­niz­ing group with a ma­jor prob­lem. In fall of 1973, John R. Clarke was sent to at­tend a con­fer­ence at the Ed­u­ca­tion­al Test­ing Ser­vice near Prince­ton Uni­ver­si­ty. While there, he sneaked off and went to the IBM Sci­en­tif­ic Cen­ter in Philadel­phia to meet with Iverson and Falkoff. He then pitched the idea of cut­ting a tape and us­ing it at the ban­quet. Iver­son was not im­pressed, but when Falkoff ask why it should be done, John replied that he would bet 90% of the peo­ple us­ing FOR­TRAN did not know who John Bac­cus was and how FOR­TRAN was de­vel­oped. Falkoff went to see Iver­son, and it was agreed. The show would be cut. Iver­son had giv­en John a copy of the de­scrip­tion of sys­tem/360, and the TV sta­tion had the op­por­tu­ni­ty to set up the props for the show. The tape was shot in re­al time the morn­ing be­fore the ban­quet in the evening. There was no cut­ting or prac­tice ses­sions. There was a meet­ing the pre­vi­ous evening in which about the on­ly thing that was agreed on was the word "ba­sic" should not be used, and "fun­da­men­tal" should be used in­stead. David Clements the host, was a sys­tems anal­y­sis/pro­gram­mer who worked for the dis­trict da­ta pro­cess­ing. He had had some TV ex­pe­ri­ence pri­or to join­ing CC­CD. He had al­most no APL ex­pe­ri­ence. www.aprogramminglanguage.com

Why it's here

3 people recommend this

What people say. Recommended as a fascinating historical interview showing the mindset and engineering philosophy of early programming language pioneers.

zgeon Lobsters • Recommends

The Origins of APL (1974)

sunkencityon Hacker News • Recommends

On “Why APL Is Still Cool”

I recently bought "APL an interactive approach" and read it. It seems that most of the good stuff from APL is already present in modern languages, and better when it's lazy. The OO stuff in APL looks kind of crufty. Still it's a wonderful fascinating language. In the age of mature open-source it feels very old fashioned with the expensiveness of a decent implementation. Btw, this is a fantastic tv segment from days of yore "The Origins of APL - 1974": link to this video

znowion Hacker News • Recommends

On “Ruins of forgotten empires: APL languages”

There's a great link in the original comments to a video from 1974, where Iverson, Falkoff, and others discuss the origins of APL. It was a pleasure to watch. A peculiar contrast in language and attitude to today's rockstars and ninjas :) link to this video

shitgooseon Hacker News • Mentions

On “"Careless" employees”

…erable. On the other hand, there still are a few decent, old school devs, who don't need hand-holding, constant poking and distraction of standup meetings and writing meaningless test cases that check if 2+2 is still 4. They just (1) understand the problem and (2) write code that solves it. As simple as that. Good old engineering, like these guys: link to this video . Or original SAS system - its reference manual was better quality then any statistics textbook. Unfortunately those days are gone now and we live in the kingdom of Scrums and Frameworks.…

theszon Hacker News • Mentions

On “Scaling long-running autonomous coding”

Skilled devs compress, not generate (expand). link to this video The "discoverer" of APL tried to express as many problems as he could with his notation. First he found that notation expands and after some more expansion he found that it began shrinking. The same goes to Forth, which provides means for a Sequitur-compressed 1 representation of a program. 1 link Myself, I always strive to delete some code or replace some code with shorter version. First, to better understand it, second, to return back and read less.

theszon Hacker News • Mentions

On “Way AI assistance impacts the formation of coding skills”

link to this video APL inventor says that he was developing not a programming language, but notation to express as much problems as one can. He found that expressing more and more problems with the notation first made notation grow, then notation size started to shrink. To develop conceptual knowledge (when one's "notation" starts to shrink) one has to have some good memory (re-expressing more and more problems).

u/treerexin r/compsci • Mentions

On “Are there any good computer science related documentaries and/or movies that you really enjoy?”

I like this one about the origins of APL from the early 1970s. Not a documentary per say, but very interesting: link to this video