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#ssl#tls#certificateauthorities

DEF CON 19 - Moxie Marlinspike - SSL And The Future Of Authenticity

DEFCONConference

419K subscribers • 61 videos on Hallway • Conference channel

YouTube
  • Recommended by 4 people: 4 on Hacker News.
  • A classic. People kept recommending it from 2018 to 2023.
  • Presented by Moxie Marlinspike, creator of Signal
  • May be out of date. Uploaded 13 years ago, in an area where tools change fast.
  • An opinion. It argues one side of a question engineers disagree on.

Intermediate. Assumes working knowledge.

11K views13 years ago4 recommendations

SecurityWeb developmentCryptographyWeb and application securityHow browsers work

Moxie Marlinspike critiques the Certificate Authority system of SSL/TLS and proposes an alternative trust model.

Moxie Marlinspike - SSL And The Future Of Authenticity In the early 90's, at the dawn of the World Wide Web, some engineers at Netscape developed a protocol for making secure HTTP requests, and what they came up with was called SSL. Given the relatively scarce body of knowledge concerning secure protocols at the time, as well the intense pressure that everyone at Netscape was working under, their efforts can only be seen as incredibly heroic. But while it's amazing that SSL has endured for as long as it has, some parts of it -- particularly those concerning Certificate Authorities -- have always caused some friction, and have recently started to cause real problems. This talk will examine authenticity within SSL, shed new light on the current problems, and cover some new strategies for how to move forward.

Why it's here

4 people recommend this

What people say. Highly recommended as an excellent and entertaining explanation of the structural flaws in the TLS certificate authority system.

mashedvikingson Hacker News • Recommends

On “Mythology About Security”

"Often hear that the reason today’s Internet is not more secure is that the early designers failed to imagine that security could ever matter." Related to this, you should definitely watch Moxie Marlinspike's (lead dev of Signal) talk where he tells about his discussion with Kipp Hickman, a developer of SSL: link to this video (until 16:33)

8organicbitson Hacker News • Recommends

On “Weakening TLS protection, South Korean style”

I've found Moxie Marlinspike's talk 1 to be a great overview of these sorts of issues. IIRC, he built an alternate system discussed in the talk. But I believe that's defunct. (Tangent, anyone know the postmortem on that?) link to this video

maqpon Hacker News • Recommends

On “Encrypted web traffic now exceeds 90%”

Moxie has good points about the problems TLS has. And they are not about breaking TLS via cryptanalysis: link to this video

mbakkeon Hacker News • Recommends

On “Security expert warned SolarWinds in 2019 that anyone could access server”

Whenever I hear statements like "incredibly complex and sophisticated attack" I'm reminded of the 2011 Comodo (now Sectigo) hack where the company said it had "clinical accuracy" and "likely to be a Iranian state-driven attack". Days later, the perpetrator released a "manifesto" (and several other documents) all but confirming that it was the work of a lucky amateur. Moxie (of Signal fame) has a hilarious account of the story in his 2011 Blackhat talk "SSL and the future of authenticity" (starts at around 5:00): link to this video

arantiuson Hacker News • Mentions

On “Moving forward on improving HTTP's security”

Recently learned of link (talk: link to this video ) which sounds quite promising. It's not perfect (private, non routable sites?) but removes the certificate authority oligopoly from the picture without reducing security (AFAICT).

1cvmaskon Hacker News • Mentions

On “YouTube removed a Cybersecurity channel without much reason”

Will they remove Moxie videos then because he makes cybersecurity videos funny and points out the inherent failures in SSL? link to this video

cypharon Hacker News • Mentions

On “Let's Not Encrypt (2019)”

…o, but I wonder if they would actually block a big CA like LetsEncrypt if it came out they did something shady or got hacked. It just seems incredibly unlikely they would flip the "turn off >60% of the internet" switch regardless of what LetsEncrypt hypothetically did (for reference, in 2011 Comodo signed only 20-25% of website certificates). 1: link to this video 2: link…

cypharon Hacker News • Mentions

On “Parallel Reconstruction of Lawful TLS Wiretapping”

> One of Web PKI's security holes is the fact that any CA can issue valid certs for any domain. The only official "mitigation" for that is voluntary and can be defeated. In case you were not aware, Moxie Marlinspike spoke about this at length back in the early 2010s1. His view was that the problem is that certificate authority trust is controlled by the wrong people (web hosts, not users -- or browsers, as a proxy for user wishes) and is not possible to revoke because once a web host uses a particular CA you are stuck trusting them forever otherwise the internet will break. > The solution to that is to rearchitect the Web PKI ecosystem to use domain registrars as the sole source of truth f…